-scape- group *voice* chat?

^ It won't be any worse than text chat. In fact, it'll probably be tamer considering people will be speaking directly and won't feel the need to be internet superheros.

Are you talking about me?

haahhahah i'm dying to hear Iskanderia through voicechat.

uh someone should just decide the date and thats all, i dont think all this fine discussion should end up with nothing.

Iskanderia wrote:

Are you talking about me?

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Nah. Towards the end of the night everyone gets a little ahead of themselves from time to time.

@Ravenson: I'll wait till the poll is done. So far there is no set date. Once this poll is over, keep an eye on the chat thread for whether or not we'll actually do it.

Kyuketsuki wrote:

Iskanderia wrote:

Are you talking about me?

Click to expand...

Nah. Towards the end of the night everyone gets a little ahead of themselves from time to time.

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Stop it. Stop picking on me.

Kyuketsuki wrote:

You're very incorrect here. Please check out past threads, when you have the time. There's not a lot going on right now- mana's pretty dead at the moment, Gackt's just rehashing old favourites, Klaha's been MIA for ages, Kozi's started up potential activity yet but I don't think anything new has been put out so far. Hora's been dead recently, and Kaya's also taken to rehashing old releases.

We're in a bit of a drought, as I said earlier, with artists related to Malice Mizer. Since this is a specialized forum, I suppose things can only be so active, as it's heavily dependent on the activity of a small group of people. If that small group of people isn't up to much, then things get chatty in order to keep the forum alive until something worthwhile comes up to be discussed.

That, and when you've talked and debated with the same people for a few years, it's hard to remain business-like towards them on the INTERNET. I know you're not into the touchy-feely stuff, Antaeus, but I don't think you can really crucify us for getting along so well.

Everyone is welcome to come to the chats- there's been no question about this. Therefore, to dispel some of these claims, I'd like to ask that everyone that perhaps doesn't regularly show up to please come to the next one.

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Well, personally I don't think this forum is limited to those artists. I know they are the main focus of this forum, but there are plenty, I repeat, plenty of other artists to talk about. There are so many bands with a similiar sound as Moi Dix Mois. Almost no one has mentioned anything about those bands. Same for the electronica artists. Maybe Hora hasn't been that active the last year, but there are plenty of other electronica artists to discuss about. Both from Japan and other countries. Actually, it was pretty good that someone opened a thread for GPKism - not related to this forum, but definitely interesting for quite a few members of this forum. Sadly, those topics are rare compared with the 'show a pic of yourself' and similar topics.

The artists you have mentioned all belong in one of the following genres: J-Rock, Darkwave, electronica or metal. You can't tell me nothing is happening in one of those genres. All those genres are still very active.

Hey, I am all for creating a community. I referred to 'the old days', just like you did. I don't know how the old days were on this forum, but as you maybe know too, plus minus 5 years ago forums weren't about 'Listening Now' and 'Random' threads. Forums were always full with intelligent people who wanted to share their knowledge about their passion. That is something that is seriously lacking on this forum. Everytime when someone says 'I think X' and you reply to that, they don't discuss. They just simply agree or say something valueless. I don't say the members on this forum are stupid, but they should show more of their intelligent side, because honestly - no one really cares about what you are currently listening or what random thing popped up in your mind at a specific moment.

I find it funny that you say I am not 'touchy-feely'. I am still on this forum because there are a few members who I respect, and I like reading their posts(also because they actually put some thoughts in their posts). I don't mind building a community with such members. Of course, I am also active here because it is the quickest source to what Hora is doing, but it's not my only reason.

Personally I am fine with a few spam threads, but the forum should focus more on activiting the users on sharing their knowledge about the things that brought us to this forum.

(Ok this was very offtopic )

Antaeus wrote:

I don't know how the old days were on this forum, but as you maybe know too, plus minus 5 years ago forums weren't about 'Listening Now' and 'Random' threads. Forums were always full with intelligent people who wanted to share their knowledge about their passion.

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I don't know where I was during this mythical period five years ago when the internet was full of humorless intellectuals who did nothing but discuss their Very Important Opinions about music.

Not everyone is looking for the same thing on the internet. Some of us are just here for escapism and news about things we think are cool. Not all of us are in the mood to write 30 page dissertations on the symbolism in GPKism lyrics or the effect of post-modernism in the blah blah blahgiddity blah.

Antaeus wrote:

because honestly - no one really cares about what you are currently listening or what random thing popped up in your mind at a specific moment.

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I think that the fact that those two threads are very popular would seem to disagree with you. YOU may not care about these things, but a lot of us actually enjoy things like talking about what songs we like and what's going on in our lives and, gasp, "joking around."

Antaeus wrote:

The artists you have mentioned all belong in one of the following genres: J-Rock, Darkwave, electronica or metal. You can't tell me nothing is happening in one of those genres. All those genres are still very active.

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And the artists all came from Malice Mizer (except for Kaya and Hora), which is why this forum started in the first place. (c'mon, we're even named after a Klaha song )

If you really wanted threads about those genres or whatever, why don't you open up your own threads? No one's stopping you. If enough people are interested, then it'll keep going.



and yeah, I'm going to try to revive the main forum a bit whenever I get my Klaha package from SOMEONE.

Antaeus wrote:

Kyuketsuki wrote:

You're very incorrect here. Please check out past threads, when you have the time. There's not a lot going on right now- mana's pretty dead at the moment, Gackt's just rehashing old favourites, Klaha's been MIA for ages, Kozi's started up potential activity yet but I don't think anything new has been put out so far. Hora's been dead recently, and Kaya's also taken to rehashing old releases.

We're in a bit of a drought, as I said earlier, with artists related to Malice Mizer. Since this is a specialized forum, I suppose things can only be so active, as it's heavily dependent on the activity of a small group of people. If that small group of people isn't up to much, then things get chatty in order to keep the forum alive until something worthwhile comes up to be discussed.

That, and when you've talked and debated with the same people for a few years, it's hard to remain business-like towards them on the INTERNET. I know you're not into the touchy-feely stuff, Antaeus, but I don't think you can really crucify us for getting along so well.

Everyone is welcome to come to the chats- there's been no question about this. Therefore, to dispel some of these claims, I'd like to ask that everyone that perhaps doesn't regularly show up to please come to the next one.

Click to expand...

Well, personally I don't think this forum is limited to those artists. I know they are the main focus of this forum, but there are plenty, I repeat, plenty of other artists to talk about. There are so many bands with a similiar sound as Moi Dix Mois. Almost no one has mentioned anything about those bands. Same for the electronica artists. Maybe Hora hasn't been that active the last year, but there are plenty of other electronica artists to discuss about. Both from Japan and other countries. Actually, it was pretty good that someone opened a thread for GPKism - not related to this forum, but definitely interesting for quite a few members of this forum. Sadly, those topics are rare compared with the 'show a pic of yourself' and similar topics.

The artists you have mentioned all belong in one of the following genres: J-Rock, Darkwave, electronica or metal. You can't tell me nothing is happening in one of those genres. All those genres are still very active.

Hey, I am all for creating a community. I referred to 'the old days', just like you did. I don't know how the old days were on this forum, but as you maybe know too, plus minus 5 years ago forums weren't about 'Listening Now' and 'Random' threads. Forums were always full with intelligent people who wanted to share their knowledge about their passion. That is something that is seriously lacking on this forum. Everytime when someone says 'I think X' and you reply to that, they don't discuss. They just simply agree or say something valueless. I don't say the members on this forum are stupid, but they should show more of their intelligent side, because honestly - no one really cares about what you are currently listening or what random thing popped up in your mind at a specific moment.

I find it funny that you say I am not 'touchy-feely'. I am still on this forum because there are a few members who I respect, and I like reading their posts(also because they actually put some thoughts in their posts). I don't mind building a community with such members. Of course, I am also active here because it is the quickest source to what Hora is doing, but it's not my only reason.

Personally I am fine with a few spam threads, but the forum should focus more on activiting the users on sharing their knowledge about the things that brought us to this forum.

(Ok this was very offtopic )

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if you're as displeased with this as it comes off in this post, I really don't understand why you post here. you don't have to post to read updates about hora.

Also, I'm not sure you're too familiar with the history of the internet, which started out with bulletin boards, an earlier form of forums, and there's always been fluff. even back when you had to use dos to use computers and it was a very exclusive non-mainstream thing, people played games most of the time.

You're very incorrect here. Please check out past threads, when you have the time. There's not a lot going on right now- mana's pretty dead at the moment, Gackt's just rehashing old favourites, Klaha's been MIA for ages, Kozi's started up potential activity yet but I don't think anything new has been put out so far. Hora's been dead recently, and Kaya's also taken to rehashing old releases.

We're in a bit of a drought, as I said earlier, with artists related to Malice Mizer. Since this is a specialized forum, I suppose things can only be so active, as it's heavily dependent on the activity of a small group of people. If that small group of people isn't up to much, then things get chatty in order to keep the forum alive until something worthwhile comes up to be discussed.

Click to expand...

I would have to agree with this. We haven't seen much activity from these artist and we can't just keep discussing the same old material.

There are several active threads on various artist on these forums. Kanon and Versailles for example have been fairly active threads. Lately this has come across my mind but why not create a new sub forum for music discussions outside of the Malice Mizer artists? At least these threads won't be lost to off topic discussions in the off topic forum (and because of my OCD of being obnoxiously organized with computer related nonsense) .

Lem wrote:

You're very incorrect here. Please check out past threads, when you have the time. There's not a lot going on right now- mana's pretty dead at the moment, Gackt's just rehashing old favourites, Klaha's been MIA for ages, Kozi's started up potential activity yet but I don't think anything new has been put out so far. Hora's been dead recently, and Kaya's also taken to rehashing old releases.

We're in a bit of a drought, as I said earlier, with artists related to Malice Mizer. Since this is a specialized forum, I suppose things can only be so active, as it's heavily dependent on the activity of a small group of people. If that small group of people isn't up to much, then things get chatty in order to keep the forum alive until something worthwhile comes up to be discussed.

Click to expand...

I would have to agree with this. We haven't seen much activity from these artist and we can't just keep discussing the same old material.

There are several active threads on various artist on these forums. Kanon and Versailles for example have been fairly active threads. Lately this has come across my mind but why not create a new sub forum for music discussions outside of the Malice Mizer artists? At least these threads won't be lost to off topic discussions in the off topic forum (and because of my OCD of being obnoxiously organized with computer related nonsense) .

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It's probably like that because any band that does not pertain to Malice Mizer's artists are 'off topic'.
I'm just messing with you now. XD

My dearest Antaeus,

This is, and always will be, a forum about Malice Mizer. If you want to discuss other bands, go to forums related to that. Those few bands outside of Malice Mizer that tend to grab our attention do have threads here, but they're in "off-topic" because they are not Malice Mizer related (i.e. having to do with the topic of this forum). The End.


@Iska: You know I love you- I'm not picking on you.


Alright guys- let's get back to talking about this new potential chat format before this gets locked. I'd like it to at least survive the 30 days the poll will run, then I don't care what you do with it.

Kyu I really can't wait to jabber with you and everyone else. I think the array of accents will be very amusing yet really great. I have no problem with accents at all so I really hope more people from outside North America comes. I'm in NY after all, the meltling pot of the melting pot. XD

Iskanderia wrote:

I think that the fact that those two threads are very popular would seem to disagree with you. YOU may not care about these things, but a lot of us actually enjoy things like talking about what songs we like and what's going on in our lives and, gasp, "joking around."

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I am so sorry for being off topic but I Lol-ed so hard at the sarcasm. ... Back to lurking.

Sorry about the delayed reply here.

Kyu, my reference to a lack of music discussion has little to do with the scape artists. Before, even when nothing was going on with the scape people we had healthy, active discussions about other bands--old and new--in off topic. I don't see that anymore. Much of it has to do with the fact that the people who contributed to and generated those discussions have left or rarely post anymore and it's not hard to see why. All that's left are the chatty types--and I don't mean chatty as in friendly, I mean chatty as in cliquey. We've always had cliques but at least before those cliques generated discussions. Now the cliques are just about in-jokes. It's positively vapid in here, and the chats imo are not helping.

I know Flowers gave you the go-ahead for the first chat, and since he's the boss he has the final say on things. But I do not recall him ever encouraging the chats take place beyond his initial permission for the first one. Again, imo they have gotten out of hand and become too official. I appreciate you doing your best to moderate then, but you're not a moderator.

If the chats do indeed generate such interesting discussions, and discussions about music, that is all the more reason I think they should be suspended--to bring that conversation back to the forums.

The chats are actually a wasteland of nonsensical over-posting, imo. xD

Also, I have to say that I'd definately contribute to musical discussions more if I didn't feel like people would attack my opinion and/or write it off because I'm young.

The atmosphere of this forum isn't a positive one overall, and I think a lot of people get heated very quickly, which makes people less willing to make a solid contribution to a discussion.

When I do add to discussions, I have to put like a thousand disclaimers of "THIS IS MY OPINION" and "I THINK PERSONALLY" throughout it, or people will freak out.

Amatsu wrote:

The chats are actually a wasteland of nonsensical over-posting, imo. xD

Also, I have to say that I'd definately contribute to musical discussions more if I didn't feel like people would attack my opinion and/or write it off because I'm young.

The atmosphere of this forum isn't a positive one overall, and I think a lot of people get heated very quickly, which makes people less willing to make a solid contribution to a discussion.

When I do add to discussions, I have to put like a thousand disclaimers of "THIS IS MY OPINION" and "I THINK PERSONALLY" throughout it, or people will freak out.

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Kind of why I tend to just keep my mouth shut in the Moi Dix Mois forum.

@ Amatsu and Lem
You guys really shouldn't have to censor yourselves like that. The people that take things too personally and get offended over an opinion are the people that really have no business on the internet.

I'm all for discussion and debates, because given the subject matter, I thrive on those sorts of things. navate, you're right, things are different than they used to be and whether or not that's a good thing, who knows? And honestly, there weren't many people who left because of the people here...I can only think of one or two. The others just stopped posting without any reason whatsoever.

And the only clique I see around here are the forum regulars, which is natural in every forum...not just this one.

@Navate: Well, I agree with you on the lack of discussion in the main forums. However, most of us who *have* been on scape for awhile have stopped posting there because it's been overrun with fan girl nonsense and none of us really care how totemo kakkoi mana/gackt/yuki looked in whatever photoshoot. I'm all for expanding the site's picture database, but that thread is ridiculous and I've told flowers so. It's crap like that that keeps me away from Main these days. As for MdM, I shied away from that even longer before thanks to people not being able to accept constructive criticism on Mana's work and getting in a fangirl huff over how perfect it is in every way. Scape's always been on the bickery side, but at least it was usually bickery with people who somewhat knew what they were talking about (even if they thought they were the end-all on what they were talking about) and different opinions could be shared. Now it's turned into a wasteland of LJ jrock group poster and other people who must think they're cool for posting at scape or something, I have no idea. I'm a bit of a jerk to people when I run into that stuff (i.e. last time I ever posted in the picture thread) so I stay away from it because people think I'm being 'mean'. Whatev, that's fine, but since that's the only mess going on I feel that I have no business being there. Same with the mdm forum.

I am not a moderator. I do not want to be a moderator. Why? Because then I couldn't be a jerk to people anymore and I think I enjoy that more than I could if I had godmod powers at scape. Personally, I think that if there *weren't* things like the random/listening/reading threads and the chat which really did bind us together as a group (which flowers did attend the last one, or second to last one we had), many of us would have been gone a long time ago, leaving you and Flowers with batsu's reject fangirl crew (honestly, I don't keep track of who posts in there, so if you're someone who posts there regularly and are offended, I'm sorry, but that's really what I see going on over there when I get up the nerve to look) in their select threads with not much else.

However, I have said in the past, and even here, that these chats are completely up to the whim of you and flowers, so if you guys want, you two talk it over and decide if you really want us to continue. This little pet project has always been and your mercy. However, I guess it's judgment day so have at it.


off the record from this post: Navate, I love you, I really do, but you're hardly ever here any more, and I know that's probably because you think we all suck now, but I can't see how that gives you room, aside from mod status, to tell us we're ruining the forum by doing something like this. If you think things need fixing, be here, start actually posting again, and try to work with what's here instead of just sort of going, "I think it sucks and you shouldn't do it," and then disappearing into oblivion again because that isn't really fair, you know? I have the utmost respect for you, so please don't take any of that the wrong way, but I'm trying to be honest. Therefore, I will apologize now for any upset my words might cause you because it isn't my intention to do so.

navate wrote:

All that's left are the chatty types--and I don't mean chatty as in friendly, I mean chatty as in cliquey. We've always had cliques but at least before those cliques generated discussions.

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Isn't respecting other members one of the rules? Because even though I'm not sure if you meant it as I took it, but I kinda feel like that statement is disrespectful to every regular poster on scape, and I also feel like since you are a moderator, it doesn't make sense for you to say it, because you have the power to step in and stop the kinds of things like cliques and whatnot from the first time you notice them, and I haven't seen it.

I'm sorry, but that's been bothering me. Your post made me feel slightly betrayed by someone who I looked up to.

Also, I'm not critisizing you as a mod, please don't take it the wrong way, I just think that your statement was kind of an insult to the members of scape. :/

::prays not to be banned::