Who do you think is the best guitarist?

[Mao]

I really don't have a problem with mana's influences....it's how he uses them is what bothers me.

It's like ever since malice mizer broke up, he just doesn't care anymore. It's just a job now.

 

[rizumu]

The proof is in the sound of the songs, and while I personally don't have so much of an issue with Mana's influences and how they effect his musical composition strategies.. I at least notice and acknowledge them.

I'm not denying Mana has classical influences or that his songs have that sound to them, and that's not the proof I'm asking for. What I was questioning is that Mana opens up books of etudes and jots down the notes line by line as has been said.

 

[Mao]

Look, it's been a long time since I've bothered any of this stuff, so it's not exactly fresh on my memory. I don't care to win you over or anything, I just know what I've seen and heard.

If I ever get around to going to my friends apartment again (in Lousiana), I'll ask her to dig up the old etude book she showed me, and I'll tell you which one it was and who it was by. But for now, you can just pass off what I'm saying all you want. It doesn't make it any less true. It's just not there to you.

 

[Elec]

No need to get so antagonistic. And as for your assertions, the burden of proof is on you.

 

[LejuN]

Mao ~ yeah, it is not there to us. So unless you have some proof, get over it. You can go on your mana is a hack crusade all you want but don't expect to win anyone over unless you have something to back it up other than I was at a friend of a friends house and we had a pillow fight and then bashed mana o-o//

Seriously. Either back it up with some serious research or get over it.

And don't give me "the proof is in the songs" kazuo. Back it up as well. You guys can talk big but all you really want to do is bash. It is obvious where his influances come from. Hell, he has even stated it himself. But I doubt he sits there and rips exact classical songs all day.


+LejuN+

 

[Formless]

I'm not bashing anything. o__o; All I said was I don't think his guitar skills are that great and that his influences are pretty obvious. I didn't say he directly copied anything. You can hear similarities, that's all. Mao said something rather different from what I said.. When I said "recycled" I didn't mean "stole directly from".

Everyone gets so angry and defensive over an opposing opinion. Do you think that everyone is going to have the same opinion? No, they aren't. I'm not speaking for Mao here, I'm speaking for myself. Don't give me that "well if you don't like it, don't post" because that's taking it out of context. I am in no way being immature and I'm certainly not trolling. This is a poll, and polls are open to opinion. Would you rather I just say "OMG I HEART SUGIZO MANA IS A FAILURE!". No, I don't think that way. Mana contributes to his music in a different way than Sugizo, but this is a poll about who's guitar skills are my favorite and due to my opinion, which I backed up, I get jumped on? Sorry, remind me not to express my opinion anymore.

 

[Anonymous]

Kazuo -___-; you're the one taking things out of context. Nobody jumped on you for your opinion at any point, so what's with all the drama? All LejuN said is that that's not good enough. If you really think you can hear other people's music in Mana's song then prove it like I did with Kyomu and people can judge for themselves. Don't just say 'it's so obvious I don't even have to prove it'.

And I didn't jump on you for your opinion earlier either, nor was I directing anything specifically at you. I haven't even voted in this poll because I could care less who the 'best' guitarist is so I don't even have an opinion to dissagree with yours in the first place.

 

[Formless]

Well I didn't mean for things to get out of hand like this. I just.. got a little ticked off. When I said "The proof is in the music", I wasn't saying that I, myself, hear direct copies. I was just saying it like "Well, if you listen to the music and some other classical pieces I guess you'd hear it." A friend pointed out similarites between Dix Infernal and a Bach piece. I can't remember which though because, at the time, I didn't care to hear about it all that much.

All in all, I did go a bit overboard before, I apologize for that.

 

[LejuN]

Kazuo, all I will say is that you put a lot of words in my mouth.

Also, can I ask, do you happen to know Mao from anywhere?

Anyway, I had a point but I am tired. I will come back to this thread, though.

+LejuN+

 

[Formless]

Well, like I said, I apologized for my behavior. And, no, not to my knowledge. I'm not familiar with anyone named Mao except for a friend of mine who speaks broken english. o__O

 

[Elec]

I think Mana's guitarrage was actually fairly impressive when he and Kozi mind-melded for their double-team 2-hit COMBO attack like a 2-man Voltron and rocked socks all over Shi no Butou and Shiroi especially.

And I realized recently how little Luna Sea I know, actually. O_o

 

[Dix Princesse]

I love their duos. *_* Shiroi, Shi no Butou, Tsuioku no Kakera...

 

[Formless]

I think Mana's guitarrage was actually fairly impressive when he and Kozi mind-melded for their double-team 2-hit COMBO attack like a 2-man Voltron and rocked socks all over Shi no Butou and Shiroi especially.

And I realized recently how little Luna Sea I know, actually. O_o

That was the greatest comparison.. ever. Voltron <3

 

[Mao]

Kazuo, all I will say is that you put a lot of words in my mouth.

Also, can I ask, do you happen to know Mao from anywhere?

Anyway, I had a point but I am tired. I will come back to this thread, though.

+LejuN+

Really, I'm certain I don't know Kazuo from anywhere, I just jumped onto a a tangent from what they were saying, and then it all exploded. I really don't mean to piss anybody off, I'm just stating my opinion. I think we're all getting out of hand here.

 

[Mao]

I think Mana's guitarrage was actually fairly impressive when he and Kozi mind-melded for their double-team 2-hit COMBO attack like a 2-man Voltron and rocked socks all over Shi no Butou and Shiroi especially.

This I will agree with. It's why I liked Malice in the first place. I loved how the guitars would intertwine with eachother and trade off the melody. It was brilliant. Why couldn't mana get another guitarist and keep that up in m10m. (Ok ok, I know he's going for black metal and all....but...I CAN WISH, CAN'T I!)

 

[Elec]

I never liked how at first with Voltron, everyone's costume color matched their lion...and then the guy in the black lion left, and red guy Keith went to the black lion and that blue guy went to the red lion and the princess went to the blue lion, and it threw everything off; I was so anal retentive even back then...

One thing I DO appreciate about Mana's guitar-slingin' now, though, is how much more interesting he is to watch in m10m as opposed to MM. Like, he's more 'one' with his guitar now, as opposed to MM where I really wanted him to put down the flowers and the slide whistles and the razor scooters and play his damn instrument! :-P

 

[LejuN]

I really don't mean to piss anybody off, I'm just stating my opinion

Stating your opinion is fine. I wish you guys would quit saying we don't allow you to do this... e-e I think we don't appreciate when someone always ends their opinion with something like "it is there, you are just not seeing it" or "sorry it is just not clear to you". Well, that is not stating. That is more implying that what you are saying is "fact" and we are all just too stupid to see it. So think how you word things better in the future.

Because personally, I don't care if you despise mana and think he is the shittiest person alive. But unless you can back this up with facts, don't try to make it out to be one.

+LejuN+

 

[Mao]

Yes your highness.

 

[Einherjer]

Hmm. I say Mana from MM alongside Kozi, but I'm not sure if I mean "best guitarist" or kick azz composer. All are competent at what they do, but in my opinion none of these guys are prodigies. I will however say that mana is certainly the virtuoso, at least based on what i have seen on scars of sabbath.

 

[Kageryu]

One reason, why I voted for Mana, was that I saw him live ( on DVD at scars of sabbath and really live in germany, although that's unfair to hide).